On netwwork and off network refer to whether you are using another carrier tower site.

If you have a national plan, then you get free roaming off and on other carriers network, but just the same way that your message waiting indicator icon,may not work properly if you were on say a T-mobile tower.but he same way the feature of discounted international dialing is the rate we can guarentee when you on our network, if you t-obile's towers then they do have the right to charge you more, if you look up the p&p in CSP portal as to the rates it does tell you that.

Right but the point is that on network or off network on a nationwide plan, treats the minutes the same... So the international rate would be the same, whether on or off though..

jramossteel said:
Right but the point is that on network or off network on a nationwide plan, treats the minutes the same... So the international rate would be the same, whether on or off though..

No jackie, close but just short of the mark.

The roaming agreement says that they can roam without incurring any roaming fees, but thats it.your features still only work on your companies network.The discount international feature only gives you the discount on the cingular network as its cingular feature, not anyone else's network.

"Rates apply to calls dialed directly from your wireless phone. Airtime rates above are charged in addition to package airtime minutes. Calls to satellite phones (country codes 870, 871, 872, 873, 874, 881, 882) are $11.49/minutes; $9.75 per minute with Cingular Basics. Calling to some countries may not be available. Rates apply to Cingular Wireless customers only. Certain billing and credit restrictions apply. Must be approved to dial international except for countries which can be dialed direct.

The rates and terms on this page are applicable to customers subscribing to Cingular World Basics after November 15, 2004. Cingular World Basics rates apply when calling from within the calling area for the rate plan to which you subscribe.< ...
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That's how I was informed it was. So if it was changed, it was never communicated to sales.

You are right.

Pir doesn't know his a$$ from a hole in the ground.

😲

jramossteel said:
That's how I was informed it was. So if it was changed, it was never communicated to sales.

Guys, ladies, he(original poster) was having issues as to DIALING INTERNATIONLY from within THE USA.He was getting billed the non discounted international long distance rate.

The ONLY reason anybody since has been complaining about roaming is that its a POSSIBILITY that he was calling internationaly on the other carriers network as the discounted int'l long distance rates apply if you are on cingular's towers, if you pick up a CellOne tower or T-Mobile tower, you get the non discounted int'l long distance rate!!!!!!!!!

Mr.PIR said:
...if you pick up a CellOne tower or T-Mobile tower, you get the non discounted int'l long distance rate!!!!!!!!!

That's the issue we're currently debating. If you're on our Nationwide GSM plan with the $3.99 Cingular World Basics ("discounted international long distance") and you're calling from anywhere in the USA you are supposed to have the same rate.

http://www.cingular.com/customer_service/internation ... »

That link should get through anyones firewalls. Scroll down the the very bottom where they always display the fine print.

"Cingular World Basics rates apply when calling from within the calling area for the rate plan to which you subscribe."

The calling area the c ...
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you have explained this already. he still doesn't seem to understand what Cingulars TOS' are. It's also in CSP for any employee to see.

I know I have explained it, but I'm still waiting for an explanation... I was hoping repeating it might have made it more clear, because I can be a little vague sometimes..

http://csp.cingular.com/Facets/Long%20Distance/ILD_F ... »

Preffered rates only apply on Cingular Network Only within LMCA (small subset of customers "home" airtime footprint, not including calls placed on Roamed SIDs)

No, it says 'same footprint in which customer’s package airtime applies' Since you're considered 'in-network' ANYWHERE in the USA with a Nation plan, the discounts apply.

Also, you just violated NDAs for posting a link to proprietary information. To the Agonizer booth!

coldsteel said:
No, it says 'same footprint in which customer’s package airtime applies' Since you're considered 'in-network' ANYWHERE in the USA with a Nation plan, the discounts apply.

Also, you just violated NDAs for posting a link to proprietary information. To the Agonizer booth!

sorry , i have copied that right from the link, so no sorry play again! 😁

First you request proof, i give it then you tell about NDA, you are a very complex weird person.

http://csp.cingular.com/Facets/Long%20Distance/ILD_F ... »


Preffered rates only apply on Cingular Network Only within LMCA (small subset of customers "home" airtime footprint, not including calls placed on Roamed SIDs)

Ah, I do see that but it also says that's on the older ILD packages. The current ones state "Discounted ILD rates apply throughout the same footprint in which customer's package airtime applies."

If the original posters account was a migration it would have to be on the newer plans. If it was older, then a simple change of the SOC codes would make sure they are always billed at the same rate. They should not have to be "on network" as long as they are on the proper coverage area they signed up for.

ralph_on_me said:
Ah, I do see that but it also says that's on the older ILD packages. The current ones state "Discounted ILD rates apply throughout the same footprint in which customer's package airtime applies."

If the original posters account was a migration it would have to be on the newer plans. If it was older, then a simple change of the SOC codes would make sure they are always billed at the same rate. They should not have to be "on network" as long as they are on the proper coverage area they signed up for.

We were migrating customers since october, the DAY 1 announcement was nov 15,2004, but were doing migrations since oct 1,2004.

Honestly, I don't remember... so I'll concede that point. It even makes sense that his billing could've been fubared because of it, but it still stands to reason that updating the SOC codes would give them the ILD rates anywhere in their calling area.

Thank you for taking the time to look up the CSP document, as I hate navigating through CSP.

My service's were established as new service. Nothing was ported. But along the way, the 7PM nights were not added and the $3.99 international calling plan didn't have a country code. I have hard copy of all services being established along with the account.

What I find odd is that the computer will bill for the Int'l plan, but not require a country code when accepting that plan. On the other hand, if I have an Int'l calling plan, why doesn't it just bill any Int'l call at the special rate, code or no code. Either way, and I've had country coded and no country coded billing, so why isn't the bill at the correct rate? Some programmer's should be looking for work.

All the calls are on Cingular. My phone has always shown Cingular. Other...
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canddmeyer said:
$3.99 international calling plan didn't have a country code. I have hard copy of all services being established along with the account.


so why isn't the bill at the correct rate? Some programmer's should be looking for work.

All the calls are on Cingular. My phone has always shown Cingular. Other calls from same locations show Cingular. My ATTWS, which I still have, shows Cingular but bills at the correct rate.

thank you you just answered the key question

Eligibility Requirements and Service Tenure for ILD Service

Customers Eligible Upon Meeting Tenure and Payment History Requirements:

1)Good payment history with 6 months uninterrupted service with Cingular(at least 6...
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well... that did settle it. All that long drawn out discussion and it ended up being an error on the part of the original rep who added it. I'm gonna go sit back down in my corner and play tiddly winks.

ralph_on_me said:
well... that did settle it. All that long drawn out discussion and it ended up being an error on the part of the original rep who added it. I'm gonna go sit back down in my corner and play tiddly winks.

Remember you do that too long in the corner, you'll go blind! 🤣 🤣 🤣 😕

That's one thing I'd like to see on Discovery's "Myth Busters"....

ralph_on_me said:
That's one thing I'd like to see on Discovery's "Myth Busters"....

😁 🤣 😲 😈

I know I'm getting really off topic here, but didn't that saying come from a book called Vitalogy? Not the Pearl Jam cd, but yes that's where they got the name from. I think it was around the time Kellog invented his Corn Flakes.

Mr.PIR said:

canddmeyer said:
$3.99 international calling plan didn't have a country code. I have hard copy of all services being established along with the account.


so why isn't the bill at the correct rate? Some programmer's should be looking for work.

All the calls are on Cingular. My phone has always shown Cingular. Other calls from same locations show Cingular. My ATTWS, which I still have, shows Cingular but bills at the correct rate.

thank you you just answered the key question

Eligibility Requirements and Service Tenure for ILD Service

Customers Eligible Upon Meeting Tenure and Payment History Requirements:

1)Good payment history with 6 months uninterrupted

...
(continues)

It says outside the footprint... So the way I would understand that is that when you are "off network" Like if I was in Canada on a nationwide plan... Not if I picked up a T-Mobile tower while I was at home. But that might just be me.

That's what I take it for also. It seems pretty straight forward to me, granted the old ILD plans look like they weren't provisioned that way.

I just asked my TL about it, and he stated that the "off network" does effect the rates, i asked whats the difference from the old befroe 11/15/04 and before, so he flipped me this e-mail as to the difference:

Overview:
Currently, International long distance dialing has two pricing structures:
Standard (default) Rates
Discount Rates ("Cingular World Basics" is the newest product name)
The Cingular World Basics feature requires a monthly $3.99 fee but offers lower per minute rates (See Cingular World Basics Pricing).

Up until 11/14/04, Cingular offered "Preferred (Discounted) ILD Rates" (IZCC and IZC1-IZC7 codes). These rates are not as attractive as the new "Cingular World Basics" ILD rates.

Encourage customers to move from...
(continues)

That's wierd because when Rich banned Blueguy, I had contacted him about it and he stated that Blueguy and Agent Debit were in fact the same person.

Does it really matter?

A dumba$$ is a dumba$$ is a dumba$$.

it depends on what features, and if they are compatible with t mobs technology. but yea there is a chance it may not work. unfourtinuitly if you read the terms and conditions almost every carrier mentions not being able to provide or garentee feature services/airtime service off network. its a sucky deal and i agree...you pay for a feature it should work anywere you need it to. but the way this biz is set up.....well sometimes sh!t happens

phoneshark said:
In California, Cingular and T-Mo share the network. So you are saying if I'm on a T-mobile tower in California that my features will not work? Is that what I'm understanding?

If your phone says on it, T-Mobile then your features like your message indicator icon may not come on, if they use the same type of voicemail system it would, but if they used a different system then it would not.You have to remember that carriers features, services, tech, everything is unique to that carrier, so your features are unique to cingular, so other carriers may not suppport your features.

same thing as if you say added incoming and outgoing features on your plan to prevent you from making those calls and...
(continues)

uh,....thats basiclly what i said...you just made it sound more technical. in addition you forgot about the fact that if the dohickey in the whatchimacallit, dosent register the thingamabob into the thingamajig, then nothing works at all. also, the thing at that place has to do the other thing at the right time or that stuff dosent do whatever it is supposed to do. thats kinda key. speaking of keys, i have wayyyy to many. house keys car keys other car keys...they should just be like passwords....but i have alot of those too. over 20 just for work.....forget the ones i use for my personal emails and such. i get alot of emails you know....most of its spam tho. kinda like when you get junk mail flyers at home..i notice that during the summer t...
(continues)

temp said:

bluzmn78 said:
you have to be a customer with Cingular for Six months before the preffered international roaming can be added on to the account. If you where a customer that had migrated from ATTW to Cingular we would need to find out how long you have been a customer with ATTW and use you past history to see if we can add it on.

not true there HAS to be some sort of exception process, and i bet she has like the wrong feature on her acct or something, one of my friends that works for cingular told me that they recently changed the SOC code for the international long distance plan and that they have been having issues w/ the people with the old SOC code getting billed at t

...
(continues)

Mr.PIR said:

temp said:

bluzmn78 said:
you have to be a customer with Cingular for Six months before the preffered international roaming can be added on to the account. If you where a customer that had migrated from ATTW to Cingular we would need to find out how long you have been a customer with ATTW and use you past history to see if we can add it on.

not true there HAS to be some sort of exception process, and i bet she has like the wrong feature on her acct or something, one of my friends that works for cingular told me that they recently changed the SOC code for the international long distance plan and that they have been having issues w/ the people with the

...
(continues)

First off, as to the blueguy crack, thats ok, there was someone on here who saw me and that person on at the same time, so whatever.

As to how often they get denied, you would have to ask the fraud department, they determine whether the person gets denied or appproved.So call them and ask them, I don't work in the fraud dept.

Actually, I am slightly amused about Cingular rules re the Int'l calling plan. It amazes me that I can purchase a home, a new vehicle, take expensive vacations, but supposedly cannot run up $0.10 a minute on a Cingular plan. But it's ok to up my FT plan from $59.99 to $249.99 monthly and add all sorts of extra's like Media Works, 7PM nights, and whatever else there is, but I cannot call internationally for $0.10 a minute.

Sorry, but Cingular is being run by idiots. Luckily, someone saw the light and let me be a Cingular customer, otherwise it would be Verizon seeing the $$$. Other than the credit check when I established service, there has never been any questions or requirements regarding my int'l service. By the way, had Cingular impose...
(continues)

You did thats why you wren't getting the right rate on your bill -Hello!!

As for the 6 month wait.Its to prevent fraudulent activity.Whats to stop a person from using the company to call international racking up hundreds and hundreds of dollars calling international then skipping out on it, the 6 month waiting period, is getting down to it, is to find out if your a "deadbeat customer" or not, thats why you have to have 6 months of continous uniterupted service, and not suspended during that time frame for non pay.

FYI, the rep can't override that policy.it(discount) can only be on the system once that timeframe is up or if the Fraud department authorizes it, so unless you spoke to the Fraud department or have on with cingular for 6 mo...
(continues)

Also when you run a customer's credit, they can be at a certain credit level in our systems and credit and activations can add it as well, the six months would be if their credit isn't high enough from the start.

Jackie here is right from CSP as to that:
This if the customer does not meet the eligiblility requirement of 6 months

Section 4 - Exception Process

All exception requests for ILD must be reviewed by the ****** Fraud Group by filling out an "Exception Request Form". The procedures for sending this form are:

From:
Date:
Subject: International Exception Request
Account Number:
CTN/Mobile:
Customer Name:
Contact Number Other Than the Mobile:
Your Dept/Group:
Your Manager:

The ****** Fraud Group will review the account and return to the sender with an approval or denial response within 72 hours. Also, Fraud group will contact the customer with their decision within 72 hours. THE FRAUD DEPARTMENT WILL NOT ADD THE SO...
(continues)

Section 1 - Customers Who Already Have Long Distance

Cingular and AT&T Wireless customers who already have International Long Distance service are eligible for the corresponding Cingular World feature(s).

This information for former AT&T migrated customers can be found in the Blue Customer View (CVD), on the Subscriber Profile Page for the mobile number, under Features.

Blue customers can get it when they sign up as long as they had it before...


Section 2 - Customers Eligible Upon Activation

The following customers can be provisioned for International Long Distance upon activation or at any time during their tenure:

Category Details
Telegence Markets Determined by Credit Class
Customers in Credit Class:

A (Governm...
(continues)

thats ok jackie, its east to mistake it when you do both business and consumer, its easier for us here since all we handle is care. Don't sweat it! 😉 😉

This is not an eligibility discussion. If I wasn't eligible, I wouldn't be making those calls. Cingular has elected to grant me international calling, but cannot bill properly. But the calls would be billed correctly if I didn't have the plan, and would be hundreds of $$$. The point is the calls are being billed incorrectly.

If Cingular has failed to give me the proper documentation to fill out that would alleviate my situation, then why doesn't the fraud department or anyone else send them to me? I've only had 5 contacts w/Cingular the past 4 months. Or better yet, why am I still calling internationally? Obviously it's not the issue the CSP makes it out to be.

I appreciate your feedback, but it doesn't correct my billing.

Its not that, ok, let me try to explain so "Hopefully" you will understand within the first 6 months, the customer would be able to make international calls" the difference is the feature that gives you the discounted rates , can only be added to your account after you being on service for 6 months.

Its similar to ATTWs policies they had, in their case it was 90 days from service was activated, if you wanted the discounted festure, you either had to wait the 90 days, or you had to fax off documentation to the IWC, international wireless care to get it approved.Till then you could use and pay full price.

The only difference cingular has you wait 180 days or you fax in to get permission to get discount, otherwise you pay full internation...
(continues)

Why are you asking me?